We watched in horror yesterday as FOX news featured a 4 year child, Kanon Tipton, being interviewed as a “gospel preacher”
We were horrified and amazed that FOX would stoop so low as to demean true Biblical preaching and evangelism with this side-show… but they did.
I will not put the video here to advertise it further but it almost made me sick to watch it and see videos of him “preaching” to an audience who gave him “amens” and applause. The kid can neither read nor speak intelligibly nor describe what he is “preaching.” He has simply learned the movements of and emulated his father, a Pentecostal preacher of the United Pentecostal Church in Mississippi.
A friend, James, gave me a “heads up” about this poor, exploited child a few minutes ago.. Thanks James.
“Speaking of the 4 year old interview on Fox news, his family are members of an anti-Trinitarian organization. UPC [United Pentecostal Church] His father is the District Superintendent for the UPC Church of Mississippi. I thought the JW’s were bad in their attacks on the Trinity, the UPC are just as bad. Info on Kanon’s dad: http://thepog.cc/#/our-teamBlessings, James
Even if the doctrine were sound, what you described would be exploitation.
Yes, Modalism is simple terms, the Father becomes the Son, the Son becomes the Holy Spirit, etc. The United Pentecostal also teach baptism is necessary for receiving eternal life, based on the one verse in Mark 16 I believe it is. At any rate, a little four year old who has no idea what he is screaming as he copies his father, is absolutely being exploited. It is very sad, because preachers are not to be novices, and of course we know a man (an adult) of one wife. This poor little guy was allowed to get up there and ‘preach’ at 21 months old. I saw an ‘Oprah’ clip on multiple child preachers. They could get up there and ‘preach’ but some members in the audience wisely asked them to explain in their own words what they were saying. Long story short, they were unable. To explain their screaming at the top of their lungs, they cited Isaiah 58:1. I was so sad for these kids, one whose father said if they didn’t understand it in the KJV language (vs. having it explained to them) they needed to ‘just shut up’…
Jason, maybe so. I tried to open the link from the article, but it was no longer there.
The late Jack Weaver wrote the article in question about six years ago.
I thought United Pentecostals denied the distinctness of Jesus and the Holy Spirit, not the deity. Their error is called modalism. They also teach Lordship.
Lena, according to the article, the church that was pushing this young boy denies the deity of Christ Jesus. There is NO WAY that the Holy Spirit (of Whom this unitarian church also denies the deity) would be involved in any teaching that denies the deity of either Jesus or the Holy Spirit.
Shame on you , that you would have the
Ordasity to speak such a remark about a
young boy who is filled with the Spirit of
God and has such a love for Christ and His word. And a calling upon his life .
Thank you Jesus for Kanan.
There is no junior Holy Spirit. But the same Spirit in children and in adults .
I am so inspired by this young man. Full of the
Holy Spirit and loves your word. No afraid to
speak your truth Jesus.
May you raise up Kanon to conquer this world
for you Jesus.
Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended?
who hath gathered the wind in his fists?
who hath bound the waters in a garment?
who hath established all the ends of the earth?
what is his name, and what is his son’s name,
if thou canst tell? Proverbs 30:6
Only God has the power to take life back up again.
Jesus took His life back up, just as He laid it down. Only God is perfect. Jesus was perfect, sinless.
(also from Ray Stanford, but it’s all Bible, look it up).
Matthew 28:19 says, “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the NAME (singular in the Greek) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” If there were three gods, or if one were God, and one were a created being, and the other were just God’s “power”, then the verse would have to say to baptize in the “names” of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.
God is very exact and lets us know in this verse that though there is only one God, He is a triune God.
Even in Deuteronomy 6:4, where it says that “Our God is one LORD (Jehovah),” the Trinity is proven. In Hebrew there are at least two words translated “one.” The word “one” in this verse is “echod” and means “a unity.” The Hebrew word “yachid” is the word meaning “an absolute one.” The word translated “God” in the Hebrew is “Elohim” and means three or more. God says precisely what He means.
I am sorry I misunderstood on the one point Tyler. There are some websites out there that are ‘anti-lordship’ while at the same time being unitarian and anti-trinity. Some of them say it is a ‘Catholic doctrine’. The arguments are weak in that they try to take certain verses and say they should be translated differently and willfully turn a blind eye to the many others as you have clearly ignored the many other Scriptures that proclaim that Jesus was present before Abraham, present with God, was God and is Creator of all things.
The Scripture is clear, the Father is God
The Holy Spirit is God.
Jesus is God.
Jesus is the Lord of glory (1 Cor 2:8), same title for God. Only God can forgive sins, so why did Jesus? (some will say we can forgive others, but that is for sins against us. He forgave all manner of sin).
I mentioned Him being called Emmanuel, God with us, confirmed again in John 1:1 and 14 (John mentioned that you have not answered that either). That also is confirmed again in Luke 1:68, Blessed be the LORD GOD of Israel for He hath visited and redeemed His people (God with us). Then of course Isaiah 9:6, He is identified as many things, but the Mighty GOD is one. His name alone means Jehovah Saves.
As briefly as possible I’ll share a few more from an article Ray Stanford did. Luke 8:39, Jesus cast out demons but told the person to go and shew what great things God had done. Nothing wrong with the translation, Jesus is God.
Jesus accepted worship (John 9:33-38), but the OT says we shall worship no other God except the LORD. Jesus did not sin. Christ did accept worship. For Christ is GOD. ( See John 5:23.)
John 10:33; 12:24, 14:7, 15:24 – all Identify Jesus as also having seen the Father. The reason Christ can say that when someone has seen Him he has also seen the Father is that Christ is GOD, one and the same as the Father.
They accused Jesus of blasphemy for making Himself God. He did not commit blasphemy. (Jn 10:30-33).
Acts 20:28 – When did God shed His blood? God shed His blood when He took on flesh in the person of Jesus Christ and shed His blood for our sins. Christ said in Luke 22:20, “. . . This cup is the new testament in My blood, which is shed for you.” Revelation 1:5 says, “And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto Him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in His own blood.”
God shed His blood when Jesus shed His blood because Jesus is GOD.
Micah 5:2, also prophesying of the coming Messiah, says, “whose goings forth have been from of old, FROM EVERLASTING.”
But Psalm 90:2 says, “Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from EVERLASTING to everlasting, thou art GOD.”
Christ was from everlasting, was in existence and one with God before the world was formed (John 17:5) because Christ is GOD.
Tyler appears to have hardened his heart to that truth.
If the Word is everything that God is, that is tantamount to deity. God is God, so the Word must be God also.
Tyler, I understand your position, but don’t agree with it.
Thanks for commenting at ExPreacherman.
John thank you for allowing to have my post be posted so that I could be understood I used to be a trinitarian like y’all did. but from the research I’ve done I can clearly see that it’s false you may not agree with that. that’s your choice I’m not going to force you to believe what I believe and I believe that John 1:1 should be translated John 1:1 in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and what God was the word was. the word that he spoke in the Garden of Eden in Genesis 3:15 became flesh a real person in John 1:14
Tyler, I understood what you were saying, but there was some misunderstanding on the parts of some other commenters. Hence, I allowed your most recent comment to be posted.
We can have no fellowship with you, as you are adamant that anyone who believes in the deity of Jesus will end up in hell.
You never did address John 1:1 and John 1:14.
Tyler, what part of John 8:58 do you not understand?
you missed understood what I said. I said that a person who accepts continued faith and obedience as necessary for being saved are not saved that is lordship salvation which I’m against and I said that a person is not saved if they believe in the trinity and the deity of Christ because that is a form of polytheism and if you let this post be posted people can see that clearly and not misunderstand me
Jason, that was my understanding of Tyler’s comments as well.
I understood Tyler to be saying that those who do not believe that Jesus saves “without continued Faith or obedience to Christ Commandments” are not saved. Tyler also made denial of the deity of Jesus an essential, and that is extremely problematic. Hixson has said that one does not need explicit knowledge of the deity beyond a confession that Jesus is “Son of God”, but here we have an explicit denial. Jesus cannot save us without being fully God. Most deity denials are lordshippers when it comes to works for salvation, so Tyler’s beliefs are a strange combination that does not save.
Tyler, you said if those who didn’t have “continued Faith or obedience to Christ Commandments are not saved and will be annihilated in the Lake of Fire”.
By your own words you are condemned. Just the two greatest commands, to love God with all your heart, mind, soul and strength, you have to admit you have failed if you are honest. If not, you are not truthful, and if that is the case, you know not one lie will enter heaven (Rev 21:27), so it’s done, you cannot do it. A man cannot save you. Only Jesus, fully man, fully God can save. By Jesus were all things created (Col 1:16). He was BEFORE the angels since He created them, and as the Scripture you twisted (Jn 8:58), He was BEFORE Abraham.
I pray for your own sake you might see how futile your beliefs are. They are in another Jesus. Not the Jesus testified of in the Bible.
Tyler, I already said that we would not post any more of your comments that deny the deity of Christ.
Based on your written testimony, you do not believe the gospel now. Whether or not you ever did, none of us can know.
I will pray that you will soften your heart to God’s word, and that you might understand the gospel message.
Do you read Hebrew? In Genesis 1:1 the word God is translated Elohim which when disected is three deities in one word. Look up El, then look up oh, then look up im. This name is also in the word Emanu-el. Isaiah 42:1-5 explains these connections. The word lord in the beginning of v.5 is translated El also. Gen 1:26 is clear as day when Elohim says let US make mankind in OUR image. Being that you can’t see the image of God without could it be and based on previous scriptures that image was Jesus Christ? 1Cor 11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. Do you believe that God was a man or could be one? Image wise?
(Comment edited by administrator).
—Isaiah 44:6 “Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel, And his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: ‘I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God.
The King and Redeemer of Israel is the Lord of host, the First and Last, the only God.
—Revelation 2:8 “And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write, ‘These things says the First and the Last, who was dead, and came to life:
Jesus is King of Israel, Redeemer, was dead and came to life, conclusion Jesus is the First and Last, the only God.
The Trinity is prominently on display in Ephesians
Those who deny the Trinity cite Bible verses which state that Jehovah is the only God and “present” these as somehow “refuting” the Trinity. Tyler did this twice. This is a strawman. The Trinity doctrine teaches that Jehovah is the only God.
Hebrews Chapter 1 clearly proves the eternal preexistence and full deity of The Lord Jesus Christ. Read Psalm 102:12, 24-27 and then Hebrews 1:10-12
Tyler, we understand your views, but do not agree with them.
John 1:1 and John 1:14, combined, are an irrefutable biblical record that Jesus is God in the flesh.
Any more comments by you that deny the deity of Jesus will not be posted.
and I’m not a Jehovah’s Witness by the way I am a Unitarian Christian there is a big difference I don’t believe that Jesus was some pre-existing angel I don’t believe that he even existed until his birth Matthew 1:1 Deuteronomy 18:5 2nd Samuel 7:12-14 Luke 1:32-33 psalm 88:27 Hebrews 1:5 Hebrews 6:13 Hebrews 6:16 Matthew 24:36 makes it clear that he did not exist before his birth
when Jesus said I am he in John 8:58 all he was saying was that he is the chosen Messiah who was not God but who would become the Lamb of God and mediator between God and man .and yes I believe that all those who reject that Jesus Christ is a created being who is only the Son of God and that only Jehovah alone is God and that the death burial and Resurrection alone will save a person without continued Faith or obedience to Christ Commandments are not saved and will be annihilated in the Lake of Fire
Holly, John 1:1 and John 1:14, read together, also provide an irrefutable Biblical record that Jesus is God:
 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Tyler, you deny Jesus is God? Let me share that Jesus is Jehovah. He identified in John eight different times that He was the great ‘I AM’.
The Old Testament tells us that only Jehovah is Savior. The New Testament tells us that unto us this day in the city of David is born a Savior, who is Christ the Lord. Lord means God the Messiah (in terms of a title for Christ).
How can a man save you? How is it that everyone is saved (Unitarian) when the Bible is clear that you must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ in order to be saved?
The good news is that God sent His Son (fully God, fully man) into the world as an offering, a ransom for ALL men (1 Tim 2:1-6). His name is Emmanuel, God with us. Because God loves us with a great love (Jn 3:14-18; 15:13), He gave Himself for us, dying on the cross for our sins (1 Cor 15:3-4), being lifted up on the cross to draw all men to Himself (Jn 12:32), ALL men. He was buried and rose again from the dead, as He said He would multiple times. In Zechariah 12:10, it says they will look upon the One (God) in whom they have PIERCED. When did they pierce God?
In John 10 Jesus told them that no one took His life from Him, but He gave it willingly, and that He had the power to take His life back up again (only God can do this) and only God is Savior the OT tells us. He alone had the victory over sin, death and the grave (1 Cor 15:50-57). If we believe He has done this for us, the testimony of God about His Son lets us know we possess eternal life as a free gift (1 John 5:9-13; Rom 6:23), not through any works of our own (Is 64:6, Eph 2:8-9).
Do you believe salvation is a free gift? Do you believe you were saved from an eternal hell, strictly based on what He has done? Do you believe Jesus is God come in the flesh? If you don’t, the Word is clear, Jesus said:
And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things. John 8:23-24
If you don’t believe that Jesus is the “I AM” (God, the Messiah-Savior), you will die in your sins.
1Cor 8:5-6 and you make no sense in all four of your scriptures you post here. Most JW theologies are based on single scripture fulfilments. When it comes to Gods word you must include all scripture that layers the context to complete it and keep it from contradiction. Its all about the context.
Jesus is and always was part of the Godhead-Trinity, and Jesus was never created.
OSAS and not Deity? That is a strange concoction. And I don’t think that saves.
Tyler, according to your confused understanding, neither me, nor any other Christian is actually saved.
The Bible is explicitly clear that Jesus is God in the flesh.
me I’m a once saved always saved no matter how you may habitually behave Unitarian Christian who denies the trinity and that Jesus is God because it’s not biblical Jehovah is the only one who is God Deuteronomy 6:4 Romans 3:30 1st Corinthians 8:6 Galatians 3:20 and Jesus is only his Son whom he CREATED through the Virgin Mary Isaiah 7:14 Matthew 1:20 Luke 1:31 Romans 1:3-4 Galatians 4:4 those who believe in the Trinity or the deity of Christ are not saved especially if they are lordship salvationists and deny once saved always saved
Now that I read this article, I can guiltlessly join the liberals in calling that network Faux News. Not fair and balanced at all. This is on the level of the CNN bringing up Palin’s daughter.
Tina, one question: What all did Jesus Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection do for you?
Tina, thanks for your comment.
I’m a little confused by something you wrote.
You wrote: “I received the Holy Ghost at 15 years old…”
Then you wrote that later, your life had begun to fall apart and you were concerned that you were going to hell.
My comment: it is not possible for someone who has received the Holy Ghost to go to hell.
It weighs on my heart that you are all so wrong about the Apostolic faith. It is the only faith. There is one faith, one Lord, one baptism. I was a trinitarian nearly all my life, I received the holy Ghost at 15 years old at a Church of God of Prophecy. I fell into all kinds of bondage as I grew away for the Lord. I found myself in a pit of hell. I was shooting up and in chains. As the world was tearing me to pieces I fell on my face and cried out to the Lord! I said JESUS help me. I don’t want to go to hell and I don’t want to be who I am anymore!!! over a period of a few month He delivered me! He opened my eyes. I continued to seek Him and His will in my life. I was attending a baptist church after leaving a non denominational church. Every desire for drugs and alcohol was gone! As i prayed and desired the will of God in my, He led me to an Apostolic church. The first service the Holy Spirit poured out upon me. He is leading me and guiding me. The Holy Ghost is real and is Jesus in us! I pray you all are brought to who Jesus is before He returns. He will not be mocked. I will never deny Him in any way especially in baptism! My life changed forever when I went down and was buried in the name of Jesus Christ.
Thank you RAS, I’ve learned from John not to give them much of a platform, but they still try to sneak in under different names. I haven’t done a lot of new articles because of the condition of my son, but when/if the Lord is willing, I sure have a lot of ideas. One thing that I find sadly is that they really only know their proof texts well and see completely blinded to Scriptures that unseat theirs, and unwilling to discuss context. If you don’t reference the Scripture location, I have found that they don’t even recognize it. Once I used nothing but references to Scripture to put together a comment on the good character of our God. The reformed pastor snidely told me I sounded like Brian McLaren. That is not all he said, he mocked me for ‘my flowery speech’ and some other things, then I referenced all of the Scripture and told him that maybe he needed to get his head out of proof texts, systematic theology books and the different confessions and get into the whole counsel of God. Please do come and comment some time, my site is not very busy, but I pray it will be for His glory.
Johninnc you make an excellent point: more extreme work based gospels tend to make other work based gospels seem less extreme. There’s an oft used adage that T-Men are not trained to detect counterfeit bills by examining counterfeit bills but rather by studying the real thing only. Research proves this to be false; both real and counterfeit currencies are used in the training of T-Men. Since the world is crowded with false gospels and religions that hound those who proclaim the truth I believe it’s wise to study the various ways falsehoods twist what they take as their bedrock scripture and familiarize myself with their argumentation techniques…so I try.
I re-watched some old videos I have of debates on the topic of water baptism in Jesus name only (“orthodox Christianity” vs Pentecostalism). What struck me was that the “orthodox” Christian couldn’t make head way with the Pentecostal because they both defined faith the same way. Their only difference seemed to be which works would necessarily accompany faith — the Pentecostal knew it even if the “orthodox” Christian didn’t. For the Pentecostal water baptism was the act of faith. It was “the faith that saves is the faith that obeys” vs “faith alone saves but faith that saves is never alone”—distinctions without distinction.
BTW— Holly, although I have never posted a comment on your blog I want to tell you that I read it and appreciate the work you do. I noticed via recent comments made on an older article that some Calvinists came to your site to accuse you of “not knowing your Bible” and not understanding Calvinism when the article proves you understand both very well. I call that technique the “greased pig” —you can’t grasp Calvinism (they will deny that you have) therefore you don’t know the Bible. It’s not unique to the Calvinist but they play that card a lot.
You know what is so crazy? What J.Cortez stated in writing.
The fact that you think that you don’t need to do any works to be saved is crazy and the definition that you have for repentence is even crazier.
Right out there in broad daylight, then they will turn around and say they don’t believe they have to do works to be saved. Many are much craftier and more deceitful in their handling of God’s Word. That this poor man thinks he can contribute to his salvation is a death knell to his ‘gospel’ which is another. Prayerfully before it’s too late for him, he might see the truth. Please pray for John Cortez when you read this, I know you all have, but we know why this is so, there is so much apostasy.
I was thinking about the day Jesus will wipe away our tears.
There is no way on earth that we could show the proper regret for our sin because we only see in part. There is no earthly way for an ungodly man, a sinner, to show proper regret to somehow gain salvation because we are sinners. We recognized that this sin caused death, but that is the depth of our comprehension. We can feel sorrow for what we have done, but again don’t begin to fully realize the magnitude.
No way our sorrow could be good enough, it is arrogant to think so, but this is how man’s ways are. God’s ways and thoughts are above our ways. Although after we have the Holy Spirit we can express godly sorrow, it is still not enough to gain eternal life, just enough to deliver us from a consequence in this life, or a loss of reward. On that day, when we are no longer looking through a glass darkly, we will see fully and THEN we will know as we are known.
He will wipe away our tears, I kind of think they will be from finally knowing on that day.
Benchap, me too.
If someone says “I’ve repented of my sins” and if you do that too, you can have eternal life,” isn’t that another way of saying “I’m glad I’ve repented of my sins (pharisee) and am not like those other guys who haven’t turned from their sins”?
I liken the chapter to what Jesus taught about the Pharisee and the Publican.
Is the person who thinks he has “turned from his sins” for eternal life being addressed in Romans 2:1-5?
Following is an explanation of this passage from Clear Gospel:
Subject Called to Repentance: “O Man.” (vs. 1) The subject is a hypothetical audience, wherein Paul is able to address men who judge others.
Object of Repentance: The object of repentance is not expressly stated. Since repentance means “a change of mind,” we can only inferentially determine the object of repentance by identifying the thinking of those who are called to repentance. There are three words in the context that relate to the thinking of the subject who is called to repentance . . . “judgest” (vs. 1) and “thinkest” (vs. 3) and “despiseth” (vs. 4). Of these, the thing that is “inexcusable” and said to be the basis for “condemnation” is the act of judging another for that which the subject himself does (vs. 1). The judgment of the subject on other sinners is held in start contrast to the “riches of [God’s] goodness and forbearance and longsuffering” (vs. 4). Consistent with his “judging,” the Man also “thinks” that he will escape the judgment of God even though he does the same things. Again, this is self righteousness. He sees himself as “good enough” to avoid God’s judgment. Finally, rather than being moved by God’s forebearance, the self righteous “man” “hardened” (entrenched) in his self-righteousness. Rather than interpreting God’s forebearance as God’s grace, and an example for him to follow, the self-righteous man sees the forebearance of God as evidence of his (the man’s) intrinsic goodness. In a more abstract sense, this is simply self righteousness. Like the passage in Luke 13:1-5, wherein certain Judeans believed that only the worst sinners were judged (and believing they were not among the worst sinners, and therefore, not worthy of God’s judgment), the man in Romans 2 is similarly trusting in his own self righteousness as a vehicle for avoiding God’s judgment. Quite simply, the man is trusting in morality to save him. And he must repent, and rely on God’s grace for his salvation. If he relies on himself as his own savior, he will perish.
Consequence of lack of repentance: The context is plainly soteriological. The subject who fails to repent “condemns [him]self” (vs. 1), secures “the judgment of God” (vs. 2 & 3), “wrath against the day of wrath” (vs. 5), and “the righteous judgment of God” (vs. 5) if he fails to repent of his unrighteousness and reject the grace of God.
Daniel you are wise to recognize the merry go round that the other John was inviting us to take a ride on. Johninc you have directed J Cortez to the truth but it seems that he insist on taking part in propitiation as well as justification. Benchap your anger is not misplaced; there was much boasting in J Cortez’s words. Conversations with Oneness adherents are much like those with JWs, Mormons and other trinity deniers and works salvation cults—passage after passage twisted out of context, redefinition of words like faith and works, all to deny salvation by faith alone in Christ alone—dizzying.
John Cortez, your lack of fear of God and his Word is fearful to behold.
How does regret for previous sins, and a wish that you hadn’t done them, wash them away? Does grief make one righteous? Does remorse make one clean? Did Jesus say: He who believes and is remorseful for past actions shall have everlasting life but he that remorses not – the wrath of God abides on him?
Are you so foolish? Are you so blind? Have you not read that justification is not through the works of the law because by the law is the knowledge of sin? Have you not read that you who judge are also condemned, for what you judge others of…you yourself do the same things? Is a thief a thief in the eyes of the judge even if “i tried not to do it…oh, and I’m sorry for it”. No, the man is still a thief and punishment must be dealt.
Are you such a foolish and perverse man that you would spit on the cross of Jesus Christ and deny His work and your need for it.
Did Jesus die for nothing or to make Himself just in washing away the transgressions of anyone who would believe on Him to save them from the second death? Is Jesus’ payment not enough for you, that you would teach others to make daily instalments through good works and an act sorrow?
Stop teaching now. You are condemned by your own belief. You are the one Jesus spoke of when he said “by their fruits you shall know them”. You fruits highlight your unbelief, and that unbelief is why you remain condemned by the law you continue to cling to and promote for your justification.
If you sense anger in my words, you sense correctly – you don’t understand the damage your belief does to the cause of the one you claim to represent.
Daniel, the other John (John Cortez) did try to post another comment, which I deleted. His comment started with something to the effect that he was not trusting in his works alone for eternal life. I didn’t bother reading the rest.
I am concerned for John Cortez, and anyone whose testimony is that they are trusting in Christ plus something else for eternal life.
However, the main reason that I won’t keep going on and on with him, is that his false gospel of works is so extreme that it makes other less extreme – but still false – gospels of works seem less extreme. It’s kind of like focusing on John MacArthur all of the time and giving guys like Billy Graham a pass.
Johninnc, If the other John Keeps Going At it, then just prevent him from commenting. I Don’t want to start anything. I’ve had enough of the childish games with these types of people, please people just get with the gospel.
Saved By Grace! NOT BY WORKS LEST ANY MAN SHALL BOAST!
John Cortez, if you find the gospel booklet sad, it is because you find the gospel itself to be sad.
You have written quite a diatribe, so I will address just one facet of it, and let others comment if they like.
You said: The fact that you think that you don’t need to do any works to be saved is crazy and the definition that you have for repentence is even crazier. Repentence does indeed mean to feel or express remorse about ones wrongdoing and to be saved and forgiven you DO indeed need to regret (wish you hadn’t done) your sins.
My comment: It is not me who says that one is saved without works, it is God’s word.
Romans 3:20:Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
If you think you are saved by your works, you do not believe the gospel.
The Biblical meaning of repentance is “a change of mind.” Until someone changes his mind that he can save himself, he has not met the Biblical definition of repentance unto salvation.
I pray that God has mercy on you all. It was very sad to read the booklet that you linked.
The doctrine that y’all preach and accept is clearly a man created doctrine and all a big lie from satan to keep you tied and blinded from the true gospel of Jesus Christ. What you are teaching john is completely contradicting the word of God and goes against SO MANY verses in the Bible. Yours is a doctrine that is of human origin and not from God at all. The fact that you think that you don’t need to do any works to be saved is crazy and the definition that you have for repentence is even crazier. Repentence does indeed mean to feel or express remorse about ones wrongdoing and to be saved and forgiven you DO indeed need to regret (wish you hadn’t done) your sins.
IF ANYONE DOES SELECTIVE READING *RAS* it is Y’all.
here are a few out of So many texts that completely contradict the claims of not needing to obey Gods commands and laws and change the way that you live.
The first in the very text that y’all use to justify baptizing in the three manifestations of God and not in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Which if you read and examine the Bible completely you will never find a single baptism made in those three names Every baptism was made in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ which the bible says that there is no other name in which we can be saved. This verse also shows selective reading from you the fact that just 1 verse below it says that we must indeed obey his commands.
Matthew 28 : 19-20
“Therefore go and make disciples Of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit and* teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you*.”
And then another example when Jesus says in Matthew 5 : 17-20
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.” Here He again makes clear that even though he had came to place we must still obey the law until the very end of times.
and again in John 14 verse 23
“Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.”
And again in 2 John chapter 1 verse 6
“And these is love, that we walk in obedience to his commands”
Then in Romans 6 :1
“What shall we say then? Shall we go on sinning that grace may increase? By no means! We are those who have died to sin, how can we live in it any longer?”
Then Acts 2:38 says “Repent and be baptized, every one of you. In the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins”
These one clearly says that you must get baptized as Jesus also said that unless someone is born again through baptism in water they will Not enter the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 7:24 says
“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock…. but everyone who hears this words of mine and does not put them into practice if like a foolish man who built his house on sand..”
Y’all hear the true word of God but over look it and do not put it into practice so you are like the foolish man. Blinded by satan you refuse to see the truth and because you are in the flesh you cannot understand the things of the spirit.
You say that we no longer need signs to show that we are from God and true believers in him even though His word clearly says it. Maybe it is because those signs indeed Don’t follow y’all but it surely follows us- miraculous healings from cancer, diabetes, leukemia, asthma..etc, casting out demons, raising the dead, sealing with the Holy Spirit, praying for the women who can’t have children and then they do, breaking all curses of witchcraft, black magic, white magic, sorcery…. the gifts of the Spirit, Visions, Revelation, Spiritual eyes and ears, Prophecy, interpretation of tongues which is a gift and a person who does Not know other languages can still interpret many tongues, healing, performing signs and wonders … and much more so many in our congregation have them. And it is biblical Jesus said that we would do all the things He did and even greater.
Now here is this text that also contradicts what y’all teach that we don’t have to do works or change in order to achieve salvation.
James 2 :20-24
“You foolish person do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son isaac on the altar you see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did…. *you see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone”*
Also this in 1 Peter 1 :15-16
“But just as He who called you is holy so be holy in all that you do; for it is written: Be holy, because I am holy.”
Also 1 peter 3 verse 11
” .. they must turn from evil and do good, they must seek peace and pursue it..”
This verse also clearly tells that you indeed must change your way of life contrary to what you booklet says.
Also 1 john 3: 10
” this is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are; anyone who does not do what is right is not Gods child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother or sister”
Also see 1 corinthians 6
galatians 5. Those verses list all who will Not enter the kingdom of heaven among them..
Adulterers, liars, thieves, drunks, fornificators, sexually immoral, jealous people, envious people, angry people, and so many more which proves yet again that indeed there must be a change even after grace in ones life we must earn salvation in the way we live good for God to show him we are worthy.
Now all these verses are so plain and clear you cannot say selective reading because they are so many and there are so many more. Our doctrine is fully backed up with Gods word but the teachings that you have are most certainly NOT y’all just choose what is most beneficial and easier for y’all . And the word of God says that anyone who teaches a different gospel other that that thought by our lord Jesus Christ being human or angel is under Gods curse.
I will pray that Jesus breaks the chains that satan has on all of you and truly opens your eyes so that y’all may see and accept the truth.
Good answers from both John and RAS, not much to add for John Cortez.
I would like to add that when we look at the whole of Scripture vs. selective Scripture (as the enemy of our souls does), we get a clearer picture of what God is saying.
You cited 1 Cor 14 John, and RAS brought up vs. 9, and if you go further to vs. 14-15, this is what you see.
14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth but my understanding is unfruitful.
15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also. 16 Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?
Saying Amen is a way of two witnesses verifying something is true. The reader of Scriptures were start with Amen (Truth) and then the people who said Amen that were hearing, verified that it was the truth. When Jesus said Verily, Verily (Amein, Amein) He was showing He needed no man to verify that He was speaking truth, He was the truth.
I pray you would look more into who Jesus is if you do not understand He is God in the flesh. If you do not understand the three in One in the Scriptures, I know any here would be happy to relate the Word with you.
The Apostolic movement is an offshoot of the Pentecostal movement the distinction being that Apostolic Pentecostals (also referred to as Oneness) always reject the doctrine of the Trinity as pagan (in spite of overwhelming scriptural evidence) and chose to believe that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are simply manifestations of Jesus or masks worn by God. Also contrary to scriptural evidence they chose to believe that baptism by immersion in water —in Jesus’ name only—is necessary to salvation and that speaking in tongues is necessary evidence of receiving the Holy Spirit. Now if this is not what John Cortez meant by being “Apostolic” then I am not sure where he is coming from.
Saying that “tongues” was not for human understanding is antithetical to what Paul writes in 1Cor 14. “Tongues” always refers to speaking a known human language, a dialect that would require a translation to edify those who did not understand the “tongue”. Speaking in tongues, if not translated into a dialect that would be understood by the assembly edifies only the one speaking because then the only One present Who could possibly understand the tongue is God and thus the one speaking speaks not unto men “but [he speaks] unto God”
1Cor 14:9 (NKJV) So likewise you, unless you utter by the tongue words easy to understand, how will it be known what is spoken? For you will be speaking into the air.—Whether it is the music of v7, the trumpet signal in v8, or the tongue in v9, the information being conveyed is meant for human understanding and edification or else it is meaningless gibberish.
I think John Cortez has read Rom 8:26 into the context of 1Cor 14:2….and it is not there.
More could be said about the selective use of scripture (Mark 16:18 follows Mark 16:17) but I’ll leave it as is for now.
John Cortez, welcome and thanks for your comment.
Jack passed away in January of 2015, so I will address your points.
I am most concerned that your comment presumes to pass judgement as to whether or not another person possesses eternal life.
You said: Clearly the way that you both speak lets us know that your wisdom does NOT come from Christ but from this world and that the spirit of Christ does NOT dwell in you.
Second, you do not seem to understand the meaning of one of the passages to which you have referred. Your lack of understanding of this passage leads me to be concerned as to whether or not you understand and believe the gospel.
You said: Salvation is not simple and easy Jack as you put it, you contradict Gods word. If you read more deeply you will see how in Matthew 7 verses 13-14 it says that “small is the gate and narrow the Road that leads to life and only a FEW find it” if salvation was so easy why do only a few find it. And likewise there are many other verses throughout the Bible that speak about how hard it is to achieve salvation but how very well worth it it is indeed.
My comment: There are many passages throughout the Bible that speak about how hard it is to ACHIEVE salvation by our efforts. Those passages are meant to teach that receiving eternal life is impossible, unless we rely on Christ’s righteousness ALONE.
The reason so few people find the straight gate and the narrow way is because they insist on following the broad way taught by “churchianity” that adds works to the finished work of Jesus Christ.
Eternal life is a free gift, and must be received in the way it is offered. Adding works to the free gift of eternal life constitutes rejection of eternal life.
Romans 6:23: For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Third, we do not need signs any longer to tell whether or not something is of God. We need only compare it with scripture. If something someone says contradicts scripture, it is not of God.
Last, enthusiasm in worship is fine. I am just concerned that the doctrine that you teach (particularly around having to achieve eternal life) would keep lost people lost and cause non-discerning believers to stumble. Having lost people clap their hands and stomp their feet for a Savior that they might not know as Savior would be a terrible thing.
John, your comment does not indicate whether or not you have ever trusted in Christ alone as your Savior. I am concerned that you may be confused as to how one receives the free gift of eternal life.
Whether you know Jesus as your Savior, or you would like to, I would encourage you to read the booklet linked below:
Click to access English-Display-Pkg-2014.pdf
I am not a Pentecostal I am an Apostolic but I want to point out some things that I disagree with .
Starting with – The Bible says that speaking in tongues is in fact from our Lord Jesus Christ. In many verses throughout the Bible you can find it. It also states in 1st Corinthians 14:2 that it is not for human understanding but for God that our spirit speaks wonders about him. It is not blubber Marcella and not even meant for you to understand it is for God the fact that you speak about it like that clearly show that the gospel isn’t in You. The fact that the congregation gets up and cheers and claps for God is the way it should be. In Luke chapter 19 verses 37-40 The Bible gives an example that if we don’t praise him surely the rocks will. Psalm 47 verse 1-3 says that we must praise God by clapping our hands, and like wise there are many psalms and verses throughout the bible that prove you wrong on many things that you both have stated “Marcella and Jack”. Clearly the way that you both speak lets us know that your wisdom does NOT come from Christ but from this world and that the spirit of Christ does NOT dwell in you. Have y’all ever even actually read the bible? Because it doesn’t seem like it.
Salvation is not simple and easy Jack as you put it, you contradict Gods word. If you read more deeply you will see how in Matthew 7 verses 13-14 it says that “small is the gate and narrow the Road that leads to life and only a FEW find it” if salvation was so easy why do only a few find it. And likewise there are many other verses throughout the Bible that speak about how hard it is to achieve salvation but how very well worth it it is indeed.
I do not say this with a bad intent but I must be direct because the word of God says to expose the wicked and clear the minds of those who are confused. You are both decieving yourselves by calling yourselves Christians when clearly you don’t actually know much about Christianity.
My arguments to your statements are not based on my opiñions or wisdom but are backed up with Gods clear word.
Fyi . Mark 16 verse 17 says that praying and healing the sick and casting out demons are signs that will follow true believers in Christ.
I pray to God to have mercy on y’all and free you from the chains that satan has on your minds and life and to truly open your eyes so that you may see clearly.
John 8 verse 32 . “And you will know the truth and the truth will set you free.”
Jesus Christ is the way, the truth and the life!
Sherina, I join you in desiring that this child, and his parents/handlers would hear and understand the authentic gospel.
I didn’t think it was very Godly to have this little boy exploited on the intent of on you-tube, it is very sad that his parents could actually do this to further their beliefand growth of their church. They will be held accountable for what they have done. I hope that when gets old enough to read God’s word for himself that he’s able to discern the truth from the lies.
Thanks so much for giving to us the stern warnings about the anti-trinitarian movement. A link was removed because we prefer not to post any direct ties to such an heinous organization. But your word of caution is well received and we appreciate your informing us about the movement.
There is SO much weirdness in the Christian world these days. It’s staggering how far-reaching and how powerful some of these movements have gone in recent years. I plead with Christians to become knowledgeable about the Bible, especially about the nature of God and the straightforward clear gospel message of salvation by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone. I have recently been looking into a loose-knit movement called the “Revolution Church.” It began about a decade ago as a neo-Calvinist movement purportedly designed to help churches reach out to youth. It has quickly and quietly morphed into a hostile cult-like campaign which seeks to “take over” existing churches and replace all traditional trappings of Christendom [CROSSES!, altars, pews, choirs, traditional music, pianos and organs, praise groups, joyful worship services] with dark, eerie, candle-lit studio-like settings akin to MTV. So-called “worship” is characterized by loud, bombastic, unworshipful rock music—anything to make the youth feel at home, right? How about just preaching the gospel to them?
Thanks again James and thanks to Marcella for warning us about the many extreme teachings and movements with Pentacostalism.
James, thanks for the info on Hemphill. I used to sing that song, “He’s still working on me,” too. A friend of mine also sang it a a solo at her church. I’ll tell her about Hemphill. Yes, the trinity is under attack and it’s so evident in the media. I’m glad some programs have been cancelled.
I watched the video of the child preacher. Immediatly, I noticed his mother’s hair. Many Pentecostal women let their hair grow. It’s based on 1 Cor. 11, which talks about head coverings, particularly verse 6, “For if a wife will not cover her head, then she should cut her hair short. But since it is disgraceful for a wife to cut off her hair or shave her head, let her cover her head.” The women also don’t wear make up and pants, but I noticed the mother of the preacher child had make up on and was wearing pants.
Pentecostals base their relationship with god on feelings, emotions and physical encounters and experiences. Did you notice the first question the reporter asked the child preacher was, “What do you feel when you are up there preaching?” The boy said, “Jesus.” How does a person feel Jesus? He is not tangible, but evil spirits can manifest tangibly. During contemplative prayer, New Age mystics may have a tangible experience with god: heavy warmth, peace and a feeling of extreme joy and love. It doesn’t last, and it can take you on a roller coaster ride of high happiness to a valley of deep depression. I know because I experienced it for years. We should pray for this child preacher and his parents. They are deceived and deceiving people.
The doctrine of the Trinity is really under attack today more than ever. I see anti-Trinitarian programs on Christian radio, and TV. This is a real shame!!!
My concern is that by airing programs of organizations, when examined more closely are actually unorthodox, people are deceived. This deception is enhanced when programs to promote their ministry are placed among well-known Evangelical ministers and ministries. I do PTL that there have been many of these unorthodox programs cancelled from major radio and TV stations. EXAMPLE: The program Born To Win, with Ronald L. Dart, has now been cancelled from over 20 Chritians stations, due to his unorthodox teachings. I also am concerned about some of the Gospel artists, who attack the Deity of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the Holy Trinity. Example 8 time Dove award winner, author of many well known Gospel songs, Joel Hemphill, of The Hemphill’s. I used to sing one of his well known songs in Sunday school, “He’s Still Working On Me'” Mr. Hemphill has written books attacking cardinal teachings of the Historic Christian faith. How one can write books, make tapes, attend conferences that deny the Deity of Christ, and still perform concerts in Christian churches is a real shame. Last month Hemphill was interviewed on TCT-TV a large Christian TV network. He talked about his books, and stated “These are studies on the Glory of God” Sadly, some of his books are attacks on the Deity of Christ. He mentions one book, “To God Be The Glory”. This book has so many statements denying the Deity of Christ, one knows where to start. The one interviewing Hemphill did not speak up for our Lord, nor was any disclaimer given. You can view this interview at the following anti-Trinitarian site: [Removed by administrator] You will notice Hemphill’s books here along with other anti-Trinitarians, who have duped other Evangelical Christians.
May God Help Us.
Jack, your Pentecostal experience is exactly what I was involved with – healing meetings. I used to go forward for healing, but I had so much anxiety about it. I believe that was a warning in my spirit that I should not be participating or let the wolves pray for me, but I did. I then went through “training” at a revival meeting to learn how to do healing prayer, so I laid hands on people and prayed for them to be healed over the course of a year or so. Pretty strange stuff, and I never felt comfortable with what I was doing. Praise the Lord for getting me out of that mess, and praise the Lord that you and your friend left the Pentecostal church and didn’t participate in their healing time.
I went to an Assembly of God Church years ago with a friend, who invited me to a meeting. The Pastor marched up and down the aisle pointing at us and shouted, “You all are going to hell.” WOW!! Talk about being rattled. I got so scared and cried. At the end of the meeting, the Pastor and some people laid hands on and prayed for each person at the meeting. They went forward one at a time. I couldn’t wait for the people to get out of my row so I could make my escape. As soon as the gal next to me started walking forward, I ran out the back. I heard the Pastor shouting, “Hey, where are you doing? You cannot leave until you’ve been prayed for. You’re going to hell.” I cried, got into my car and drove home.
Thanks for relating your Testimony.. after all you have experienced, you have come through as a wonderful discerning believer in Jesus Christ. Encouraging!!
The Pentecostal TV program you mentioned should be titled, “Into Unbelief.”
While in Bible College, a friend and I visited a Pentecostal Church in order to write a paper about it.. We were very uncomfortable.. When they invited everyone up front for a “healing” service, we sat.. But they refused to continue until we joined them.. We walked out — and will never try that again. Not recommended!!!
So much vile misrepresentation and misunderstanding of Scripture.. Yet Salvation is so simple and easy, just as is the Christian life for the obedient believer in Jesus Christ… By Grace!!!
In Jesus Christ eternally, Jack
Sorry that I’m posting so much. If you want to contact Fox News about this video, here’s their e-mail:
Thanks to you, too, James. I didn’t want to leave you out.
I’ve seen videos of so called child preachers, and it is a monstrosity! I’ll write a letter to Fox News, but it’s difficult to know what to write to someone, who may not be a Christian, a real Christian! I get sick and tired of these circus shows that go on in the name of “Christianity.” It’s an abomination and grievous to the Holy Spirit. I visited a Oneness Pentecostal cult last year, thinking it was a church. I was shocked to witness what went on there. The Pastor stomped his feet, sweated alot and used a towel, didn’t finish some sentences when he was preaching, and then got he congregation fired up so that they stood up, clapped and cheered. Nonsense! That’s not Christianity and the gospel was not there. They had several teens in that church, and they would go into trances, blubber in some unknown language called “tongues” and then run around the sanctuary screaming, jumping, crying and sometimes falling down as if passed out. I witnessed the Pastor’s wife manipulating a young man into speaking in tongues after one of their church services. The boy went into a trance, so they sat him down in the front row. He began to moan, and my hair stood on end because it sounded so demonic! The Pastor’s wife grabbed the boy’s jaw, moved it open and closed and said, “Come on! You can do it!” She was trying to force him to speak in tongues. The boy would moan and the Pastor’s wife would yell, “Yes, yes! That’s it! Come on! Yes!” I got up and walked out. I could hear the moaning boy outside, and it sent chills down my spine. It’s absolutely sickening what these cults do, and they prey on the young people, who are looking for excitement, a thrill and a high.
Has anyone seen the TV show, “Beyond Belief”? It’s also catered to the charismatic side shows. I saw one program two weeks ago, where they were talking about near death experiences, people who had died, hovered in the air above their bodies and then talked about going to heaven. The heaven they described was not the Heaven described in Revelation. One lady in the show called herself a Christian. She told about her near death experience and then began praying in tongues. It was really creepy to watch and listen to. Another “Beyond Belief” show had charismatics casting demons out of people.
Thanks, Jack, for letting us know about the Fox news video. This is why some unbelievers think Christians are freaks and don’t want to have anything to do with us. They see videos like the one on Fox news and think we are all crazed lunatics.
Thanks for dropping in and for bringing this to my attention.
Your correction here is sufficient and duly noted.. However I do not recommend my readers visit their web site.. It definitely advertises the Pentecostal lie also.
In Jesus Christ eternally, Jack
Sorry, I was typing very fast and made a mistake. Kanon’s father is Damon, not David. Damon is District Youth Secretary Of The Mississippi District Of The UPCI.