Lordship Salvation: A Pocket Translator

By johninnc

1 Peter 1:1: Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

The Bible makes it clear that Christians are strangers, living in a strange land. That is, we are in this world, but not of this world.

As strangers, we will be in the midst of strange customs and strange language. Some of the strange language will sound very much like ours, but may mean something entirely different.

Following are some examples of statements and questions in “native language” that you WILL hear, if you are listening for them:

  • I believe in eternal life by grace, through faith in Christ, but ….
  • It’s not faith and works, it’s faith that works.
  • I think a person will change once he is saved. That was my experience.
  • A “true believer” cannot go on practicing sin.
  • The book of 1 John is a series of tests to provide secondary validation of faith.
  • You can tell whether or not someone is a Christian by whether or not they are bearing fruit.
  • Can a person who is “practicing” ___________ (insert sin) really be a Christian?

The above phrases have several possible translations, including

  1. I don’t believe the gospel. I never have.
  2. I don’t believe the gospel. I once did, but have fallen from grace.
  3. I believe the gospel, but I have incorporated the native language into mine.
  4. I believe the gospel, but I have substituted my experience for biblical truth.
  5. I am a babe in Christ, and have not yet learned that ALL of these statements and questions can be used to undermine the gospel

Anytime we hear the kinds of native language set forth above, God has given us an opportunity for witnessing or teaching – just the kind of “open doors” for which Christians often pray.

We cannot know whether the person using native language is saved or not. But, it would be reckless to assume they are.

And, just as with everyone whom we encounter, we can’t possibly know if there will be another opportunity. It is urgent that they hear the truth.

Colossians 4:5-6:

[5] Walk in wisdom toward them that are without, redeeming the time.

[6] Let your speech be alway with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.

Please note that “redeeming the time” does not include compromising with people who are intent on remaining in error and in teaching it to other people. We MUST NOT let people think we are “on the same page” when we are not.

Following are some of the tactics that people who are intent on remaining in error will use. They will:

  • Soften their position, and then expect you to reciprocate by softening yours
  • Ignore the answers you gave to their previous questions, by introducing new questions
  • Re-state your position in a disingenuous manner
  • Appeal to other people, when they can’t refute with scripture what you have told them

These tactics are all intended to get you to compromise. Remember, the gospel is not yours to compromise.

If you would like to know how to have eternal life, or would like to know how to explain it to other people, click here: THE GOSPEL

50 responses to “Lordship Salvation: A Pocket Translator

  1. “We MUST NOT let people think we are “on the same page” when we are not.”

    Grace Teaches us to separate . legalism cries “license to sin ” when in reality of Gods word its the legalist is the one who needs the license to keep the law and refuses to separate unto Truth

    Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
    Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
    Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
    Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

  2. A “true believer” cannot go on practicing sin.

    using Romans chapter 6 as proof text A “true believer” cannot go on practicing sin. and they miss the key to Romans chapter 6 this is Spiritual Baptism NOT Water of our positional Truth that The Christian life is lived from our position in Christ by FAITH knowing our identity. The legalist goes right back and places themselves under the law looking to law for “Lifestyle change ” looking to themselves. duplicating righteousness by law and not after Christ . The fruit of the old sin nature . Frustrated Grace.
    the Law is as great an enemy to Grace as the sin nature when the believer soul refuses to be disciplined by Grace and separate from false teaching idenitifed by Gods Word as a private priest before the Lord . Romans 12:1-2 availing themselves to the finished work of Christ .
    Separate unto Grace or loose Grace
    the “churchianity” realm has it plugged in backwards and they don’t even see it . myself saved 30 years and only seeing it now that is a real slick deception . The enemy of our souls only needs to keep playing that same tune over and over

    Pro 23:7 For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he: Eat and drink, saith he to thee; but his heart is not with thee.

    For the Old Sin Nature shall not have dominion over you You have freedom to choose
    Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

    that the body of sin might be made ineffective yielding to Holy Spirit
    Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

    I live by the faith
    Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

  3. Oh, you found it 🙂 Yes, sadly, I am afraid for Dale too, and for any who will listen to him and/or people like Ray Comfort-less.

  4. I found this comment, from someone named Dale, on another grace-oriented site:

    All I can say is, there will be a lot of demons in your “Heaven” because the Bible is very clear that the demons also “believe”. So, if that’s all it takes, have fun in your idea of “Heaven.”

    My comment: Dale’s testimony is that he does not believe the gospel.

    The Bible says that belief in Christ as Savior is the only way to have eternal life.

    John 3:18: He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

  5. No, dispensationalism does not teach replacement theology, however Calvinism and most loadship teachings do. Including dominionism, some of the Hebrew roots movement groups, kingdom now, manifest sons of God theology etc. Some people just don’t understand Scripture and don’t really get the difference between being grafted into the promise of the blessing and being somehow Israel. For those willing to hear, it is good to stay and show them what His Word says. Others insist the church has replaced Israel, we know the Word does not teach that. There is a remnant, God knows who they are who will be believing Israel in the end.

  6. Jerry McGowin

    I am glad to know that

  7. Jerry, let’s curtail this discussion.

    But, for clarification, WE DO NOT BELIEVE IN REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY.

    Dispensationalism does NOT include a component of replacement theology.

  8. Jerry McGowin

    Holly, we will just have to wait and see, As John as mention this Is out side of the purpose of this site, But one point I will make, One component of dispensationalism is some from of replacement theology. God still has a plan for the nation of Israel. Israel’s time is not yet over.

    but this difference does not mean we cannot fellowship together.

    respect and regards

  9. Hi Jerry — I have found dispensationalism to be one of literal interpretation, asking who is spoken to, at what time, for what amount of time (if any), and for what purpose, i.e, the purpose of the law is a tutor/schoolmaster to bring people to Christ, made of the unrighteous, not the righteous (1 Tim 1:8) and Jesus is the end of the law for righteousness for those of us who believe (Rom 10:4). Any how, I pray we will all continue to seek the Lord through wanting to study with His approval foremost (2 Tim 2:15), wanting to rightly divide His Word so we need not be ashamed. God bless us all to do just that.

  10. Jerry McGowin

    Curtis, I am not sure what the difference is. But I am grateful for hospitality found here. I have found your comments to be honest and forth coming. Although I do not agree with some of your doctrinal stances and Biblical understanding I do appreciate your high view of Scripture, which we both share and your desire to defend the fundamental doctrine of Grace.

  11. if i may please make 3 comments to Jerry
    1. there is a full doctrinal statement on expreacherman and gospel presentation

    2.as for being labeled a fundamentalist I consider myself a Fundamental Bible Believer but not a fundamentalist.
    and quote Jack NOT “BALANCED” BUT HONEST.

    3. what john said ” If you have relevant questions or comments, we will continue to post them.”

  12. Jerry McGowin

    Thank you John, it did seems to go off track, I was just trying to honestly respond to comments about what I posted. I was unaware that this was a dispensational site. My mistake. I should say in closing, I am thankful of your hospitality and you desire to Proclaim Salvation by Grace, I am aware of number of Churches who have called Calvinist to be there Pastor, from my experience many of these have not shown their true colors. and quickly began to teach Calvinism rather than God’s words. and thereby destroyed the ministry of that particular Church. It seems that this is happening all to often. Warm regards and respect, Jerry

  13. Jerry, we welcome all comments that will help clarify the gospel for people and dispel all of the false religious teaching and other assaults on the gospel that people have received from the world of “churchianity.”

    I do not want to use this site to discuss peripheral or speculative matters.

    If you have relevant questions or comments, we will continue to post them.

  14. Jerry McGowin

    I see the problem, there are a number of accounts of Muslims having visions/dreams and then being directed in the vision to seek out specific others. One such account was reported on NPR, not a source usually sympathetic to any Christian Cause. A Book entitled

    (Book reference removed by administrator)

    speaks to this tangently. Based on the information I have , the situation develops (generally as follows) confronted by the fact of Jesus either via the air waves/internet or by reading the Koran and its teachings on Jesus, and comparing that to the teachings of Iman and finding that the two do not line up — next they begin to pray asking God to reveal the truth about Jesus — next vision or dream — directs them to someone who shares the Gospel.

    I should also add I am not a dispensationalist and perhaps this is the real source of the dis-connect. I tend to examine the Scripture through a more literal lens unless it is a passage that is clearly not literal. Of course I examine Scripture using scripture. Clothed in prayer. I have a HIGH view Scripture, believing it is without error in the original text. I also accept the Bible we hold in our hand is correct in all things of faith and practice. Many studies have been done showing the correctness of Scripture with a few exceptions of spelling errors and some number errors, I am not a KJV only person. I also don’t view the Bible as a Science Text Book. Though there is science there, and I do not think science and Scripture are incompatible. I accept the Noah’s flood, and the creation story, but I do disagree on the time line some young earth-ers propose.

    I would object to Curtis M | February 2, 2016 at 7:34 pm | who stated the following: “I would like to comment by keeping in mind and striving for:
    rightly dividing dispensational Fundemenal Bible Truth .” I seek Biblical Truth. Dispensationalism may yet be proven incorrect, we will see when the Rapture comes. Fundementalism has many positive attributes, High view of Scripture is one that I share, but it also has negative ones as well. (Westboro Baptist Church is one of those), Labels usually fail to define individuals very well unless we limit them too: Jew or Gentile, Male or female, and /or lost and saved.

    Regards and respect. Jerry

  15. Excellent exposition and points Holly. Praying for you and Adam 🙂

  16. Jerry – Here are some thoughts. One precedent with visions or dreams that we see is that it always lines up with His Word and does not contradict at all. It always glorifies God. But even with Paul we don’t see him gaining salvation through a vision. He still had to pray and later Ananias came to Him, and verified the Jesus Christ was the Lord Himself (along with Israel’s Messiah). Remember, Paul already knew the Scriptures which were able to make him wise unto salvation (2 Tim 3:14-15).

    One has to come to salvation through hearing the gospel and belief in that truth. It is the gospel that is the power of God unto salvation. So if they have not heard the gospel, or are not driven to go to someone to hear (as was Paul), this doesn’t line up with Scripture.

    Our Scriptures are now complete, and the prophecy in Joel 2, was first spoken to Israel, although it says His Spirit will be poured out on all, it does seem to only signify Israel in ‘your’ old men, ‘your’ young men, etc. Joel 2 was partially fulfilled in His Jewish disciples at Pentecost, not Gentiles. We will see more signs and wonders (the sun and the moon) at the end when God turns His attention back again to Israel (the remnant).

    1 John 4 tells us to test the spirits. There is only one way for people to be saved, and that is through hearing and believing (the power of the gospel unto salvation). 1 Thess 5:21 tells us to prove all things, along with Acts 17:11 and searching the Scriptures. Remember 2 Cor 11 warns us of another Jesus and subtle deception from the one who masquerades as an angel of light.

    Jeremiah 23 talks of those who say they are speaking God’s Word. Those who say He gave them a dream or a vision and He did not. He says they speak a vision out of their own heart. If they have a dream that is from Him, they will speak His Word faithfully (not one bit will be in error). God’s Word does not lie. So the standard is the dream or prophecy or vision would have to be 100% lined up with His Word. I wouldn’t comment on whether one received a vision from God either, but I would be able to test the spirits, search the Scriptures and know by that standard.

    I personally believe we will not see additions to His Word, although there will be men prophesying, I believe because of what is said in Deut 4:2, Prov 30:6 and Rev 22:18, it will be the Word that has already been written, and it will be as when Jesus opened up the Scriptures in Luke 24 — the Law of Moses, the Psalms, and the Prophets along with the New Testament and all that is said there will be spoken to the whole world. In the last 7 years that is left in the 70 x 7 prophecy, Jesus will pick 144,000 from the 12 tribes of Israel at the end, who will go out and preach His Word, they will evangelize. The 2 witnesses in Jerusalem, they shall prophesy for half the time of the Tribulation until they are killed and I believe we see a picture of being ‘raptured’ up into the clouds (in Rev 11).

    Anyways, before this gets too long, I haven’t seen a vision or dream yet that lines up with His Word. But when tested, they explain away the portions that don’t line up. If they are unable to say they came to knowledge of Christ through the gospel message, it isn’t true.

  17. Johninc and Holly your responses above to Mwdf4christ
    are so thoughtful and well explained.

    MWD4christ thank you for the questions

  18. I would like to comment by keeping in mind and striving for:
    rightly dividing dispensational Fundemenal Bible Truth pertaining to the Gospel of the Kingdom and The Gospel of Grace .
    the Tenses of salvation , Justification , practical and living sanctification , Glorification
    realy though this could be maybe should be a whole another thread of discussion

    “…… coming to know Jesus through visions and dreams, some of the reports I have seen, that Jesus in the vision asks them to seek out a particular person in a particular place. In these cases it seems the individual had to act on the information received in a dream.”

    i would like to know the souls saw Jesus how do they know what He looks like what is the standard they are using ?
    would love to hear their testimony of How they know they have the free gift of eternal life ?
    Also would like to know or hear the person they were told to see their testimony of how they know they have the free gift of eternal life ?

    here are scripture that come to mind to me reading your post

    Mat_24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.
    Mat_24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

    Joh 14:8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
    Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
    Joh 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
    Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works’ sake.

    he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself;
    Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
    Joh 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

  19. Explanatory note to my earlier comment: I think Thomas already had eternal life prior to the passage in John 20:25-29. Verse 29 also relates to people who will afterward receive eternal life through faith in Christ.

  20. Jerry, I don’t wish to quibble.

    But, I thought the passage from Joel referred to the Jews.

    I know Peter received a vision to witness to Cornelius.

    But, regarding Muslims being directed in visions or dreams to seek out certain people to witness to them, I still am not aware of biblical precedent, nor do I feel comfortable speculating about current visions and dreams that people have reported.

    Accordingly, I won’t comment.

  21. Jerry McGowin

    28 “And it shall come to pass afterward
    That I will pour out My Spirit on all flesh;
    Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
    Your old men shall dream dreams,
    Your young men shall see visions.

    The New King James Version (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, 1982), Joe 2:28.

    Not to mention Daniel, John , the apostle, Joseph,

    2 Then God spoke to Israel in the visions of the night, and said, “Jacob, Jacob!”
    And he said, “Here I am.” NKJV Ge 46:2.

    3 It was like the appearance of the vision which I saw—like the vision which I saw when I came to destroy the city. The visions were like the vision which I saw by the River Chebar; and I fell on my face. 4 And the glory of the Lord came into the temple by way of the gate which faces toward the east. 5 The Spirit lifted me up and brought me into the inner court; and behold, the glory of the Lord filled the temple. Eze 43:3–5.

    of Couse there are many other examples.

  22. Jerry, God has given man free will to accept or reject the salvation that He has provided through Jesus.

    Incidentally, I don’t think either Revelation 3:20, nor John 20:25-29 have to do with receiving the free gift of eternal life.

    Regarding dreams and visions of Muslims, I can’t find biblical precedent, so I really can’t comment.

  23. Jerry McGowin

    I am some what familiar, with the site, and it has been several years since I have replied to posts. I have a couple of people that I mentor share with me things from time to time regarding this site and as well as others. Simply, I am concerned when “man” is completely written out of the salvation equation. Then we have Calvinism, which I strongly oppose. Man still has a role to play in his salvation: ” NKJV Revelation 3: 20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me” And Acts 16: 30 And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”
    31 So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” AND then we have Thomas: John 20: 25 The other disciples therefore said to him, “We have seen the Lord.”
    So he said to them, “Unless I see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe.”
    26 And after eight days His disciples were again inside, and Thomas with them. Jesus came, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, “Peace to you!” 27 Then He said to Thomas, “Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing.”
    28 And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”
    29 Jesus said to him, “Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

    Certainly no man earns his salvation by works ( I am using the word “Works” here in the classic meaning of KJV and not in any scientific definition). But man (humanity) must certainly accept the free gift of Grace. It is not forced upon him, though some have reported feeling a overwhelming since supernatural pressure to do so. We are also seeing a rise of Muslims coming to know Jesus through visions and dreams, some of the reports I have seen, that Jesus in the vision asks them to seek out a particular person in a particular place. In these cases it seems the individual had to act on the information received in a dream.

    I realize this is a long comment, but please forgive me if I am overly careful prior to recommending any site to young believers.

  24. Jerry, I am highly surprised that you would be concerned that we lean toward Calvinism. Your comments exhibit considerable familiarity with this site. As such, you should already know our views on Calvinism.

    In fact, back in 2012, you responded seven times to an article entitled Southern Baptists’ Fragile Détente: The Fight over Competing False Gospels, Calvinism and Lordship “Salvation”

    We haven’t heard from you since then, until today.

    Our views have not changed at all since then, even though the founder of this site, the late Jack Weaver, has gone to be with the Lord.

  25. Jerry, yes, it is free for the individual.

  26. I did not mean any disrespect, I am just trying to understand your position. Of course Grace is not free, it cost the life of my Savior. but is it not free for the individual?

  27. Jerry, we don’t go by the label “free grace.” We go by “biblical.”

    We reject both Calvinism and Arminianism.

  28. Jerry McGowin

    Yes, I have already looked at both of those links, and thank you for your quick response. Based on both of those links, I would think your entire thesis, revolves around a single instance, using poetic language, in the blink of an eye when eternal grace is bestowed/accepted as a free gift. I was concerned that perhaps you were leaning towards Calvinism, pre-designation. along the lines of Jacob I have loved and Esau I have hated. In a since this position (Calvinism) is truly free grace, or at least I think Calvinist would argue from this perspective. Response please?

  29. Jerry, we have a definition of grace, below:

    https://expreacherman.com/what-is-grace/

    And, one of our best resources explaining the gospel of grace is an article written by pastor Tom Cucuzza, linked below:

    https://expreacherman.com/2013/02/15/3-reasons-why-the-gospel-of-grace-is-the-true-gospel/

  30. I have to add the corinthians had the gifts of the spirit so they obviously were saved

  31. Jerry McGowin

    I see that your banner defines Lordship salvation, but did I miss your definition of Grace Salvation, I would prefer a definition rather than proof texts though I am certain that your proof text would be helpful too. Thankyou for your assistance,
    jerry
    .

  32. William,

    It would appear that conservative scholars place the writing of Ecclesiastes right around the death and succession of Solomon by his son Rehoboam (977-975 B.C). Thus then “The Preacher” could not only speak from his wisdom, but also his experience as it were.

  33. William, he also ignores scripture that calls eternal life a GIFT.

  34. Holly, It appears that pastor Mark Herridge deliberately ignores the account of the Corinthian Christians of the apostle Paul’s time who were living deplorably in sin and immorality, but Paul affirmed the fact that they are saved by addressing them in the following ways:

    “sanctified in Christ Jesus” and “saints” in 1 Cor 1:2.

    Paul addresses them as “brethren” in 1 Cor 2:1, as “brethren” and “carnal’ “babes in Christ” in 1 Cor 3:1, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 4:6, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 10:1, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 11:2, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 12:1, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 14:20, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 15:1, as “brethren” in 1 Cor 15:58. (KJV)

    The above list in 1 Corinthians where Paul repeatedly addressed the Corinthian Christians as “brethren” is overwhelming evidence that these are saved people possessing eternal life. Paul would not have addressed them as “brethren” if they were not saved.

    Self-righteous Pharisaical Calvinists/Lordship Salvationists would of course deliberately deny the existence of carnal Christians and would deliberately write off carnal Christians as “unsaved” despite overwhelming evidence from Scripture.

  35. My friend Don notated some typical error from a loadship pastor. He singled out a few.

    “A person can turn from sinning and still not be a Christian but a person can never profess faith in this Christ without turning from their sin. That is the Biblical teaching of salvation as declared by the Church in the New Testament. One good turn must lead to another.”

    AND

    “A person that has truly repented will hate the sin that they once loved. Any person that claims to be ‘Born Again’ but still loves their sin does not know Christ. Period!”

    My friend said “it must be rough to be Pastor Mark”.

    ( Pastor Mark E. Herridge Sr., for the purpose of marking and avoiding him)

  36. Adam, Thanks. Do you know if the book of Ecclesiastes was written by Solomon before or after he became a demon worshiper in 1 Kings 11. I always wondered about this?

  37. William,

    Excellent points 🙂

    One could also consider King Solomon in that the LORD appeared to twice, and yet at the end of his life he went after the gods of his strange wives (which he wasn’t supposed to wed either) and built high places for those false gods (ashtoreth, molech, chemosh, etc) 1 Kings 11. Interestingly enough, there is also no record of Solomon coming back into close fellowship with the LORD prior to his death either.

    Although he was the wisest fully human king the world has ever known, Solomon like the rest of us was a sinner saved by God’s unmerited grace.

  38. 1) I believe in eternal life by grace, through faith in Christ, but ….
    It’s not faith and works, it’s faith that works.

    2) I think a person will change once he is saved. That was my experience.
    A “true believer” cannot go on practicing sin.

    3) The book of 1 John is a series of tests to provide secondary validation of faith.

    4) You can tell whether or not someone is a Christian by whether or not they are bearing fruit.

    5) Can a person who is “practicing” ___________ (insert sin) really be a Christian?

    Refuted by:

    1) Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, and Roman Catholics give testimony about their “faith” in Christ and about how it has “worked” for them, but are UNSAVED.

    2) There are people in every society who were once alcoholics, drug addicts, prostitutes, gang members where some spent time in prison who have “changed” and are no longer in those lifestyles, but are UNSAVED.

    3) The book of 1 John is about FELLOWSHIP/ABIDING for those already in Christ. It is not talking about how to get saved.

    4) Again, many devout Roman Catholics, Mormons, JW’s, etc, bear “fruit”, but are UNSAVED. People who practice meditation, martial arts, yoga, philanthropy and members of the Boys/Girls Scouts of America bear “fruit”, but are UNSAVED. Many of these people also possess the attributes of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, and perseverance, but are UNSAVED.

    5) Samson was a practicing FORNICATOR – Judges 16:1, but Samson is listed as a Godly man of faith in Hebrews 11:32. He would not be listed there if he was not saved. Rahab was a practicing prostitute. Many Christians in Acts 19:18-19 were practicing sorcery.

  39. Sadly I too have often done the fourth one – turn to other people.

    And wow, how many have I met that have ignored my answers and asked more insincere questions (that is, statements of their beliefs presented as questions).

    Thanks John. Encouraging, insightful and reproving.

  40. Welcome back mdw4christ 🙂

    The explanation that Johninc has offered in response to your query I am sure you will agree is contextually and hermeneutically sound on all accounts. Regrettably, many preachers in many pulpits today recite many verses that they have either taken out of context (micro, macro), or otherwise offer inferences and conclusions they have simply invented to realize their desired end. Pretexts guising perversity abound it seems.

    I think it is also important to mention that just because one claims to be a “follower” of the Lord Jesus Christ, it does not necessarily follow (no pun intended) that they have believed the Gospel and are saved. Unfortunately, there are a few people I have come across in my travels that claim to be followers of the Lord but cannot even offer me what the Gospel is that brings salvation (Romans 1:16. 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 ). Crucially, the buzz title of being a “follower” of Jesus has seen much popularity gain as of late as it is being pushed by many of those who teach that simply believing in the Lord’s finished work and shed Blood on Calvary is not enough for salvation.

    Remember, Judas was a follower – he wasn’t a believer in the Messiah…

    Great article Johninc 🙂

    Adam

  41. So Amen!!!!

  42. mdw4christ

    None of us here believe in “the 1-2-3, pray-after-me philosophy, and if they have not believed the gospel (Christ and Him crucified for their sin, risen again to eternal life), they will not have what is needed to even begin walking in the Spirit.

    So, really, we’re looking to avoid a couple of things. (Or at least that is my motivation).

    1) That people have understood the clear gospel and we defend it. That we don’t allow others to corrupt the simplicity that is in Christ (2 Cor 11:3-4). For this reasons we withstand these people (2 Cor 11:12-15).

    2) That believers are not deceived, bewitched, brought into bondage, and therefore are not able to walk uprightly concerning the gospel, and are fallen from grace (the entire book of Galatians). They have forgotten who they are, and are ineffective, barren and unfruitful, and will not be blessed (James 1:25, 2 Pet 1:5-11) and it will affect them at the judgment seat.

  43. I can agree with your explanation. I have heard many preachers say that when we are saved, God changes our “want to”. Unless you are so much more ahead of the game than I am, you struggle with the flesh and spirit desires like anyone else.

  44. mdw, we are not excusing Christians from bearing fruit.

    According to the Bible, walking in the Spirit results in fruit. Failing to walk in the Spirit results in fruitlessness. Since believers have a choice, it is not biblical to say that all believers will automatically bear fruit.

    Christians can live like the world, and still have eternal life that can never be lost or forfeited. If this were not the case, the Bible would say so. Instead, the Bible tells believers to not be conformed to the world, but to be transformed by the renewing of their minds.

    Romans 12:2: And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

    I believe we are sanctified once and for all, the moment we believe in Jesus as Savior.

    Hebrews 10:10: By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

    I believe in being transformed by a renewing of our minds (some would call this practical sanctification). I do not believe that this is automatic.

    Teaching that life change/works are automatic and inevitable in the life of the believer could easily cause a non-believer to misunderstand the gospel and think it is about allowing Jesus to change his life, instead of believing that Jesus took away all of his sins. In this way, such teaching keeps people lost.

    In addition, such teaching may cause believers to try to look to their works and life change for assurance of salvation, and therefore try to finish in the flesh. It also ruins their Christian testimony, if their life change in any way becomes the focus.

  45. Rom 5:17 For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.) .

    I /we are striving for the Clarity of The Gospel that souls would see and appropriate the supernatural life by Grace through faith. Appropriating the Gift of righteousness to the New Man , The New Life , The New Creation.
    Turning the focus from self and sin (the old man) to the finished work of Jesus and the new man , The New creation
    To Want anything outside of the will of God is death . Yes a soul can Trust Jesus as savior and go live like they choose and die and go straight to Heaven . However that is not God’s will . There are consequences for that and loss of reward . As believer souls we are either Spiritual or Carnal there is no middle ground In our thinking not our doing. The doing is the result or byproduct of our thinking.
    Ceasing from one’s own works and collapsing into the finished work of Christ Jesus .
    Yes believer souls Should produce Fruit However that fruit is not Produced by us it is a byproduct of abiding in Christ Jesus via Holy Spirit . Active dependence passive production.
    Faith in Failure you will Fail
    Faith in Jesus Christ you will not fail

  46. I have difficulty with this series of articles as they seem to excuse Christians from bearing fruit. Do you believe that if anyone is in Christ that he/she is a new creature? I’m guessing that should be translated positionally rather than practically. The 1-2-3, pray-after-me philosophy has so many thinking that they can live like the world because they have fire insurance. I’m trying to understand if you believe in sanctification. I’m looking for clarification, not an argument.

  47. Curtis, I think about John 3:6:

    That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

  48. I have been working on a write up for the Phrase “license to sin” when i hear this it tells me the person is weak on the Clear Gospel of Grace and is averting Grace.
    there is no such thing as a “license to sin” it is a oxymoron statement wrong on several levels . As believer souls on and In Christ jesus We have Freedom to choose since the Old Man has been made inoperative . The freedom to be dead to sin and alive unto God .

  49. fryingpan, it is guys like Chan who keep the lies going. People naturally think the “big names” in the evangelism business are trustworthy, or they wouldn’t be the big names.

  50. This is excellent, johninnc. They’re all offensive but I’m personally most repulsed by, “It’s not faith and works, it’s faith that works.” And I can just HEAR Francis Chan saying, “I believe in eternal life by grace, through faith in Christ, but ….”

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